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EA GP7200 & RR Trent 900

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Beochien
Whisky Charlie

Re: EA GP7200 & RR Trent 900

Message par Beochien le Ven 23 Juil 2010 - 17:18

Bonjour !

Des chiffres encore un peu plus intéressants pour le GP7200 suivant Flightglobal ... et EA qui vendent leur produit, normal !

Au fait personne ne parle des RR T900, le PR en panne comme d'hab chez RR !!
Pas étonnant qu'un Jeddih trouve de l'espace pour s'immiscer! alien

Qu'une alliance en guerre fasse mieux que RR, ça m'énerve un peu !

Hou Hou le T-XWB, l'heure approche ... !

Car le discours du T500, trop peu trop tard, il m'a déjà énervé !
Et je ne voudrais pas voir la même inertie du côté du T900 ... !

Pas étonnant qu'Airbus ait du mal à les croire RR, pour les MC, quand les "Miracles" restent "On the shelf " laquelle va finir par s'écrouler d'ailleurs, par manque de flexibilité ! Mais de qui se fout on !

De moi, je m'en fiche ! Le Jeddih peut y aller, je suis blindé ! Mais d'Airbus, c'est plus grave !

Au fond, cela donne raison à AF dans ses choix ... et ce n'est pas satisfaisant pour MOI !

------------- Bon l'Article de Flightglobal ---------------

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2010/07/23/345113/farnborough-airbus-recognises-engine-alliance-a380-fuel-burn.html

FARNBOROUGH: Airbus recognises Engine Alliance A380 fuel burn improvement
By Max Kingsley-Jones

Engine Alliance has been given a boost by Airbus in its battle with Rolls-Royce on the A380 after the airframer officially recognised a further improvement in the GP7200-powered version's fuel burn.

"In April we received a nice boost from Airbus, which gave our fuel burn advantage over the competition further validation when it revised the 'Orange Book' performance handbook to give us an additional 0.5% credit," says Engine Alliance president Mary Ellen Jones.

She says that this was on top of the 1% credit that Engine Alliance already has. "So this puts us 1.5% ahead of our own specification to Airbus. So in our view we are 1.5% ahead of the competition."
---------------------

Alors RR on avance un peu sur le T900, au lieu d'essayer de montrer aux constructeurs ce qu'ils doivent faire avec les MC !

Franchement, le 3 arbres RR, derrière un vulgaire GE 90 2 Arbres, juste amélioré ... ca me met en colère !
Allez Jeannot emmenez cet article au Jeddih, sa réponse m'intéresse !
J'espère au moins que vous aurez le droit de le publier cet article sans vous faire lyncher !

RR = Sleep EA = vainqueur

JPRS

Beochien
Whisky Charlie

Re: EA GP7200 & RR Trent 900

Message par Beochien le Sam 24 Juil 2010 - 8:57

Bonjour !

Repris du Cousin sur Aweb !

Volvo (Dixit le Cousin) gagne du poids sur le GP7200 !
C'est la spécialité de Volvo, alléger les casings ...
Ils deviennent des partenaires appréciés, voire indispensables des motoristes !

A part cela les 1,5% d'avantage sur RR, déjà vus pour le GP7200 ... on se demande d'ailleurs pourquoi RR gère si mal l'avantage intrinsèque que leur donne le trois arbres ... la continuité, l'évolution sans risques, c'est bien, mais faut pas en abuser non plus, quand les autres vont plus vite ... ben on recule qq part !
Ca ressemble à de la stagnation !
Les seuls moteurs ou ils restent en tête RR, ... les T700, et peut être le V2500, ce sont les segments ou la concurrence ne développe plus pour cause de nouveaux moteurs à la vista !

Vive le T-XWB ... on l'attend avec impatience ... et curiosité !

---------------------- Extrait de Anonline -------------

http://www.ainonline.com/news/single-news-page/article/gp7200-reduces-weight-to-woo-a380-customers-25577/

GP7200 reduces weight to woo A380 customers

By: Thierry Dubois
July 22, 2010
Air Transport and Cargo Engines

The Engine Alliance GP7200 engine is in the middle of a weight-reduction program that may further help sales as the General Electric-Pratt & Whitney joint venture is engaged in at least three campaigns: with Qatar Airways, Kingfisher Airlines and Vietnam Airlines. The engine maker (Hall 4 Stand A10) expects 19 Airbus A380s to be in service flying its turbofans by the end of the year.

According to Engine Alliance president Mary Ellen Jones, the GP7200 has lost 150 pounds since entry into service two years ago. “We were a bit above spec,” she said. An additional 50 pounds are to be saved on engines delivered at some point next year, which will be about 100 pounds better than specified, thanks to a new turbine exhaust case.

The new component is being evaluated on an engine being used for endurance trials. To “keep ahead of any issue,” Engine Alliance engineers have conducted this maturation program in an MTU test cell, where a GP7200 has already logged 3,000 cycles at 77,000 pounds of thrust. Analytic teardown is in progress.

Fuel burn has been improved, too, Jones reported. In April, Airbus revised the A380 performance handbook to reflect 0.5-percent lower specific fuel consumption. “We are thus 1.5-percent better than our [Rolls-Royce Trent 900] competitor,” she said.

JPRS

Beochien
Whisky Charlie

Re: EA GP7200 & RR Trent 900

Message par Beochien le Sam 24 Juil 2010 - 16:54

Bonjour !

Un tour instructif sur Airliners !
Comme quoi je ne suis pas le seul à espérer le TXWB sur le A380 ..;
Noté qu'ils disent, chez Anet et je les crois, qu'un revamp du T900 ne donnera pas tout que ce que promet le T-XWB !

Noté que les risk partners sont différents entre T900 et T-350 !
Une difficulté pour les déjà avions vendus, c'est certain !

Pas une difficulté pour les prochaines ventes Airbus, ils ont le droit de choisir(Et changer)leurs moteurs !
Non mais .. que prétendent les motoristes ... la crémière en prime !


http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/general_aviation/read.main/4875228/

JPRS

art_way
Whisky Charlie

Re: EA GP7200 & RR Trent 900

Message par art_way le Ven 5 Nov 2010 - 10:38


Avarie A380: peut-être un problème de conception du moteur, selon Qantas
SYDNEY, 5 nov 2010 (AFP) L'avarie moteur subie par un Airbus A380 de Qantas, premier incident de cette gravité pour le plus gros avion de ligne du monde, le contraignant à atterrir d'urgence, est peut-être due à un problème de conception des moteurs, a estimé vendredi la compagnie aérienne australienne.

http://www.air-cosmos.com/news/depeches-afp/avarie-a380-peut-etre-un-probleme-de-conception-du-moteur-selon-qantas-2.html



_________________
art_way

Beochien
Whisky Charlie

Re: EA GP7200 & RR Trent 900

Message par Beochien le Ven 5 Nov 2010 - 11:12

Salut Art-Way !

Depuis hier on sent que ça tourne de plus en plus autour des Discs et de l'arbre IPT, déjà décrit dans les AD de début d'année, et que j'ai ramené hier !
Donc pas une surprise du tout, c'était prévisible, pour ne pas dire attendu !

Ce qui me surprends, c'est l'agitation côté inspections, sachant qu'avec des Boroscopies , on vérifie les Aubes (Utile sur les GE 90/115, et éventuellement pour les T900, pour voir si les aubes touchent les guides, mais totalement inutile pour les Disk et les Arbres, la il faut démonter au moins partiellement pour mesurer les jeux !

De toute façon, LH n'a interrompu ses vols que QQ heures, le temps de faire son inspection de bonne conscience, SIA reprendra aujourd'hui, 24 heures, par respect, normal c'est tombé chez eux !
Et Qantas est annoncé pour demain peut être !

Entre les lignes ... ben i l n'y a rien a faire de mieux, si c'est un défaut conceptuel sur l'arbre IP/ Disc (Et on va finir par l'admettre que ça plaise ou pas à RR)
Croiser les doigts et attendre les Kits de sécurisation que RR va bien être obligé de sortir (C'est peut être déjà en route depuis l'AD)
Juste une idée à moi !

Et comme je l'ai dit hier ... il y a aussi du boulot côté Airbus à prévoir !
Pas normal, beaucoup trop de pépins "Collatéraux" sont survenus autour de cet accident ... encore heureux que l'A380 c'est du costaud !

De plus, j'ai entendu ce matin à la Radio un commentaire, bien empêtré de LG, qui visiblement n'a pas surfé sur le net depuis longtemps, et lisait un "Digest oeuvre de son PR"
Ca tournait autour de l'explosion du T900, bien sûr, mais aussi de reverses "Disparues" (Les glissières oui) et de pneus (2ou3) éclatés... tout en oubliant de mentionner les diverses raisons "Airbusiennes" qui ont compliqué l'atterrissage , comme :
- Le moteur N°1 qui poussait accélérateur bloqué ..
- Des volets partiellement défaillants because hydraulique ??
- Sans compter la probable perforation d'un réservoir, et les risques d'incendie, surtout avec le train surchauffé !

J'ajoute !
Ben, on peut prendre toutes les précautions concernant les trajectoires directes, d'éléments de turbine ... pour éloigner leséléments sensibles de la dite trajectoire ...
Mais que faire s'il y a déflexion, ricochet s'il on veut, de qq aubes ou morceaux de disks, et que les trajectoires sont affectées de qq dizaines de degrés, et même si l'inertie est réduite de moitié, il en reste pas mal ... ?? Ce qui pourrait être le cas !


Chapeau pour l'équipage pour être resté sur la piste, et de n'avoir peut être éclaté que 2-3 pneus, car vu la configuration et le poids, et un moteur qui poussait en continu ... ce n'était pas évident du tout !!

JPRS

Poncho (Admin)
Whisky Charlie

Re: EA GP7200 & RR Trent 900

Message par Poncho (Admin) le Mar 9 Nov 2010 - 11:04

Bon,
Une petite com passée tout début novembre qui résonne étonnamment maintenant

Point sur le trent900Ep
Rappel du surpoids de l'EA7270 en train d'être traité
Rappel de la dispute sur la conso... EA semblant être mieux sorti de l'emballage et RR mieux sur la durée ()
Rappel sur les émissions et le bruit à priori point fort du trent900

http://atwonline.com/aircraft-engines-components/article/when-every-fraction-counts-1028


Although it may not be quite in the“my kingdom for a nail” category, Engine Alliance and Rolls-Royce are emphasizing gains of fractions of percentage points in the battle for uncommitted A380 orders. And when engine and aircraft deals are won and lost on those fractions, any advantage can be a winner.

That is the message from Engine Alliance, the joint venture between GE Aircraft Engines and Pratt & Whitney, which has delivered more than 100 GP7200 Series engines for the A380. EA President Mary Ellen Jones tells ATW, “The GP7200 has met or exceeded our customers’ expectations and Airbus recently revised the performance handbook, or Orange Book, to reflect a 0.5% SFC improvement for the GP7200-powered aircraft.” The improvement was measured from flight test aircraft MSN009 and first production aircraft MSN011 and EA believes further gains can be expected in later models.

The Orange Book is used frequently by prospective purchasers as a predictor of aircraft performance. “We believe this demonstrates an advantage of approximately 1.5% versus the competition,” Jones says, adding that after nearly two years in revenue service, the engine’s dispatch reliability rating is “99.9%.”

There are two variants, the GP7270 rated at 70,000 lb. and the GP7270E rated at 77,000 lb. The engine has a bypass ratio of 8.7 and can be certified beyond 81,500 lb. with a little additional work, as most of the certification was done at the higher thrust for the proposed freighter version.

Rolls dismisses the EA claim that the GP7200 has a 1.5% fuel burn advantage. “Only Airbus has the precise data and the company does not share that with anyone,” says Head of Marketing-Airbus Programs Richard Keen. “The Trent 900 is delivering as per the Airbus specification on weight, fuel burn and noise.” In fact, on noise it is better than specification, exceeding London Heathrow’s QC1 requirement with a QC0.5 rating. Rolls also highlights that the Trent 900’s three-shaft architecture has a slower rate of deterioration, which in combination with better-than-specification fuel burn at EIS gives it the lowest lifetime fuel burn on the A380.

The Trent 900 is certified at 76,500 lb. thrust with a BPR of 8.7. It weighs in at 14,190 lb. with a fan diameter of 116 in. In test it has run up to 93,000 lb. and can be certified up to 80,000 lb. using the current bill of materials.

While disputing the EA claims regarding fuel burn numbers, Rolls is working on leapfrogging the GP7200 with a two-pronged plan to boost the Trent’s performance. The first phase, dubbed the Trent 900EP, is available for delivery from 2011 and will provide a 1% fuel burn improvement over the in-service engines with Singapore Airlines and Qantas. The package takes compressor blade/vane technology from the Trent 1000 for the 787 that has been incorporated into the Trent 700EP launched in 2008. This ability to migrate new technology advances back into existing programs is one of the major benefits of being part of an engine family, says Strategic Marketing Manager-Civil Aerospace Future Programs Paul Randall.

Specifically, the Trent 900EP upgrade relates to a new standard of airfoil throughout both IP and HP compressor systems that is interchangeable with today’s standard. However, Rolls says that because the retrofit would require swapping out many serviceable blades, it is not actively pursuing a retrofit policy. The upgrade also includes some tweaks to the air management system. The package, which will be standard from 2011, delivers a 1% improvement in fuel burn while not impacting maintenance. Rolls additionally is incorporating “maturity modifications to upgrade areas” that have become apparent from early engines. These include tip clearance and seals.

The second phase of the improvement plan is for the 2014 timeframe and focuses on the Trent XWB for the A350. The gains are expected to exceed those of the current Phase 1 upgrade although that program is not due to be launched till 2013. The Trent XWB will be the first to feature a two-stage IP turbine and also the first to add blisks—single components comprising the rotor disk and blades. This decreases the number of components, which in turn lowers weight and improves drag. Removal of the attachment also eliminates a common source for crack initiation and propagation. Blisks are used on the GE F110 and will be used by CFM in the compressor section of its LEAP-X program. To increase cruise efficiency, the Trent XWB will have a modulation system that optimizes bleed air for turbine blade cooling. Certification is set for the end of 2011.

Director-Airbus Programs Ian Crawford sums up by saying: “Rolls-Royce has shown a commitment to continuous improvement through the whole Trent engine family. With two engines demonstrating new technologies (Trent 1000 and Trent XWB), the opportunity for further improvement is clear. Rolls-Royce will continue to review these opportunities and apply them as appropriate.”

Engine Alliance is not standing still either. “We and our customers are very pleased with the GP7200’s performance to date. We’re always looking for ways to improve even further and will stay aligned with Airbus’s A380 product plan as we evaluate the next steps,” says Jones. One improvement has been weight reduction, she says. “The GP7200 was a bit over its spec weight at entry into service. Recognizing the importance of weight to both Airbus and our airline customers, we successfully implemented a number of weight reduction initiatives in the past couple of years. The latest contributor is a redesigned turbine exhaust case that will enter service next year and will reduce engine weight by about 50 lb. At that point, we’ll have taken about 150 lb. out of the engine, bringing us to approximately 100 lb. below spec.”

Reliability


Thus far the GP7200 has had only a couple of cautionary inflight shutdowns in more than 200,000 flight hr. and dispatch reliability was 99.9% as of June 30. There have been two engine removals caused by unrelated oil pressure issues. By year end there should be 19 GP7200 A380s in service—15 with Emirates and four with Air France—and the engines will have performed 300,000 flight hr. and 60,000 takeoffs.

EK President Tim Clark waxes lyrical about the engine. “There are simply no problems,” he tells this magazine. “Meeting performance guarantees doesn’t come into it. The A380 is ahead of her specs.” And in a twist, he adds that “the faster she flies the less fuel she burns.” Long-range cruise is Mach 0.85, but “if she operates at Mach 0.83, fuel burn increases,” he says. The GP7200 has shown “no degradation” in performance.

Like EK, Qantas is delighted with the Trent 900’s performance with no IFSD issues. SIA suffered some “teething issues” with its engines but the removals were precautionary, not required for preventative action. It also had three early IFSDs, but the engine has settled down well over the last 18 months after some upgrades and changes that included solenoid valves, bleed valves, wiring, guide vanes and electronic controls.

Rolls argues that reliability statistics show the Trent 900 to be the most reliable product on the A380. It claims it has a better rating in every reliability category than the “competing” engine and is the cleanest, with the lowest cumulative emissions including the lowest NOx rating.

Emirates’ recent buy of 32 more A380s gives Engine Alliance bragging rights on numbers of engines ordered at 548 for 128 aircraft including spares. As well as EK and AF, Etihad Airways, Korean Air, ILFC and Air Austral have specified the GP7200. Rolls counts more customers, however, with Qantas, SIA, Thai International, Malaysia Airlines, Lufthansa, Virgin Atlantic, China Southern, British Airways and Prince Al Walid committed to 90 aircraft.

Qatar Airways and Kingfisher are uncommitted on engine selection. Vietnam Airlines is a potential customer for the A380 along with ANA and Asiana, while Jones says talks are underway with some potential US customers thought to be passenger airlines.

Origins


The GP7200 combines components from the GE90 and PW4000 and their combined 25 million-plus flight hr. of operation with new technologies. GE is responsible for the manufacture of the high-pressure compressor, combustor and high-pressure turbine, while P&W builds the fan module, low-pressure compressor and low-pressure turbine. Major program participants include Snecma, Techspace Aero and MTU Aero Engines.

Like the Trent 900, the GP7200 had its origins not as an engine for the then-A3XX but for the 747-500X and -600X, which at the time had a tight 33-month certification goal of December 1999. The partnership was announced in May 1996.

Rolls signed with Boeing in July 1996 and its design was based on the Trent 500 core for the A340-500/-600 scaled up 10%. Since that date, a number of partners have joined the program including FiatAvio, Goodrich, Hamilton Sundstrand, Honeywell, Marubeni, Volvo, Samsung Techwin and Kawasaki Heavy Industries.

Interestingly, EA was formed because the two companies did not think the market for the 747-500X/-600X was big enough to support three products and neither wished to repeat the incredibly sporty competition among Rolls, Pratt and GE on the original 777, an experience for which the phrase “no more three on a wing,” was coined. In another departure, the requirement to meet Heathrow’s QC2 takeoff noise level instead of the original QC4 drove the engine design.

The noise requirement, which came from SIA and Qantas late in the design process in early 2000, was more demanding than weight for both engine-makers. Then-Rolls President-Civil Aerospace programs Mike Terrett told ATWin 2004 that “for the Trent 900 and the Engine Alliance GP7200—both engines—I think that for the first time in history the noise requirement, the requirement for Heathrow, was the design point.” Both achieved the goal with a larger fan and dramatically swept blades.

The quietness of the engines is having major benefits for airlines in attracting customers, with all operators reporting very positive feedback from passengers on the quiet of the cabin. Flight attendants are also bullish on the low noise levels, which make their jobs less stressful by allowing them to sleep more readily on rest breaks.

While some had considered the A380 engine program limited, Emirates’ recent reorder has shifted the dynamics of the market, with the airline reporting more than a dozen new airports talking to it about services. More carriers well may take greater interest in the aircraft—and thus engines—that continues to turn heads and more importantly passenger habits.
.



_________________
@avia.poncho

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Re: EA GP7200 & RR Trent 900

Message par Contenu sponsorisé Aujourd'hui à 22:47


    La date/heure actuelle est Mar 6 Déc 2016 - 22:47