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11 participants

    Irkut MC-21


    Poncho (Admin)
    Whisky Charlie


    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Poncho (Admin) Mar 27 Juil 2010 - 10:36

    Bonjour à tous

    Quelques nouvelles du MS-21

    http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2010/07/27/345236/ms-21-shows-its-colours.html



    Irkut debuted the interior of its new 150- to 210-seat MS-21 twinjet family at the show, where it racked up orders from Ilyushin Finance, Russian lessor VEB-Lizing and Malaysian investment firm Crecom Burj.
    On board the bright and spacious MS-21 cabin mock-up, Irkut presented a four-abreast business cabin and six abreast in economy. It is planning to offer extra-large windows and generous overhead stowage, which it labels as being "more effective" than any other in production single aisle. Seats will weigh from 9kg (20lb) and will be the widest in their class.
    The manufacturer says the MS-21's head room of 351cm (138in) will have an 18cm advantage on the Boeing 737 and nearly 14cm on the Airbus A320. It is also claiming 4-7cm extra shoulder room compared with its future rivals.
    And now the type has attracted its first customers. Ilyushin Finance ordered 28 MS-21s and optioned a further 22 more, VEB-Lizing committed to 15 of the type with 15 options and fledgling lessor Crecom signed for 50 aircraft, which it plans to place on a dry lease basis.
    Crecom, in particular, has ambitions of a full-on partnership with Irkut. It is seeking exclusive regional marketing rights for the MS-21 - covering both sales and leasing.
    "For Irkut, we want to be the only player in the region. I don't want to have to compete with other MS-21 suppliers," says Crecom chief executive Mohamad Isa Abdullah. "We are asking for marketing and distribution rights. As a minimum, we are looking for the seven members of the ASEAN, part of South-East Asia and some other less developed areas."
    Crecom is also looking to mastermind a regional support centre for the MS-21 family through an industrial and technical co-operation which forms part of the supply contract. This would cover technical support and all types of training and could later be extended to include parts manufacturing and a final assembly line, says Mohamad Isa.
    "This would be us paving the way for other companies within the country; most likely it [the provider] would not be us," he says.
    Irkut is expecting to secure up to 100 MS-21 orders this year. Entry into service is scheduled for 2016.


    Avec les premières commandes... 87 au total
    Et la maquette de la cabine !
    Alors quelle largeur intérieure finalement ? +4 à 7 cm de plus à hauteur d'épaule (+2 à 3"), est-ce conforme à ce qu'attendait Frequent Traveller ?
    J'avais gardé en tête + 14"... je dois donc comprendre que +4 à 7 cm à hauteur d'épaule c'est par place ?

    Bonne journée

    Poncho (Admin)
    Whisky Charlie


    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Poncho (Admin) Ven 15 Oct 2010 - 14:56

    Quelques nouvelles du MS21

    http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story.jsp?id=news/awx/2010/10/13/awx_10_13_2010_p0-261543.xml&headline=Commitments For Russian MS-21 Approach 200&channel=comm



    Russia’s all-new single-aisle airliner, the MS-21, has racked up almost 200 commitments, including 50 that are earmarked for Aeroflot, and program leader Irkut says it is in talks about orders with Western airlines.

    The 150-210-seat, three-model family is due to enter service in 2016. It recently secured its most significant commitment to date from Russian state holding company Rostekhnologii, which signed a letter of intent for 50 aircraft that are expected to be operated by flag carrier Aeroflot. Deliveries are slated for 2016-2020.

    “We are fairly sure these will go to Aeroflot,” says Kirill Budaev, who is vice president sales and marketing at Irkut.

    The Russian government, which is partially funding the program, recently put public pressure on Aeroflot to “buy Russian” because the airline has turned to Airbus and Boeing for the bulk of its fleet renewal program.

    As well as the Rostekhnologii deal, a further 150 MS-21 commitments are held, including 50 each for Malaysia’s Grecom and Russian lessor Ilyushin Finance Company, 25 for VEB Leasing and five from Moscow-based airline Nordwind. Commitments also are held by one undisclosed customer.

    Speaking to Aviation Week at the Wings of Russia international aviation forum in Moscow, Budaev said that Irkut is negotiating with airlines in Europe and North America about orders, and is also looking to link up with a Western company to provide international support.

    The MS-21 is being developed by Irkut under the umbrella of United Aircraft Corp. (UAC). Development through 2016 is expected to cost 190 billion roubles ($6.3 billion), 40% of which is being provided by the Russian federal budget. The remainder will come from loans and UAC’s investment.

    It will be Russia’s first airliner design to incorporate significant use of composites and will include a carbon fiber wing. Budaev says that the joint definition phase is under way with suppliers, and design freeze is expected in 2012 with first flight in 2014.

    Pratt & Whitney is the MS-21’s lead powerplant supplier with a version of its PW1000G geared turbofan. This engine is likely to be similar to the version that would be developed for Airbus’s proposed A320 New Engine Option re-engining upgrade, says Budaev.

    A Russian engine option, dubbed PD-14, is being developed by Perm/Aviadvigatel (part of the United Engine Corp.), but Budaev says that Irkut’s efforts currently are “more focused” on the Pratt-powered version.

    The Russian twin-shaft advanced turbofan will incorporate technologies to enable it to match or exceed the performance of Pratt’s GTF, although Budaev says the engine maker has not disclosed the technologies. Contracts with existing customers stipulate that they have the option to switch to the Russian-made engine when it becomes available, Budaev adds.

    Irkut will carry out final assembly of the MS-21 at its plant in Irkutsk. Customer completions will be carried out in Ulyanovsk.


    200 exemplaires ont fait l'objet de LOI ou de commandes
    Où l'on reparle des GTF... le PW1400G du MS21 pouvant faire l'affaire des plus grosses version de l'A320NEO

    quelques dates clés :

    - Design freeze 2012
    - Premier vol 2014
    - Livraison 2016

    Ce qui indique que le PW1400G serait prêt pour la fenêtre 2014 d'airbus, avec une certif bcp plus rapide sur l'A320 vu que l'essentiel de l'avion sera inchangé...

    Beochien
    Whisky Charlie


    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Beochien Mar 15 Fév 2011 - 20:05

    Bonjour !

    Vu par le Cousin, sur A.web !

    Le MS21 reçoit une aide Gvt Russe pour 820 M$, pour le développement !
    Et une promesse de vente de 50 A/C de Aeroflot !
    Mon avis ... ça ne devait pas avancer bien vite et un coup de boost était nécessaire !
    A voir quand il sortira celui là !

    -------------- Le lien sur FlightGlobal --------------

    http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2011/02/15/353224/irkut-signs-govt-contract-for-next-ms-21-design-phase.html

    JPRS
    aeroduO5
    aeroduO5
    Whisky Quebec


    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par aeroduO5 Jeu 17 Fév 2011 - 16:36

    IL sortira en retard, comme tous les autres depuis 2005.
    Poncho (Admin)
    Poncho (Admin)
    Whisky Charlie


    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Poncho (Admin) Jeu 18 Aoû 2011 - 11:53

    Bonjour à tous

    http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2011/08/18/360943/maks-ilyushin-finance-orders-28-ms-21s.html

    28 MS21-300 pour Iliyshin finance livrables en 2019 (?)

    En continuité avec la commande de Cseries


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    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Poncho (Admin) Jeu 18 Aoû 2011 - 11:59

    Garder en tête néanmoins que BBD a signé un partenariat avec Comac Wink

    Ce qui se dessine là semble un axe autour du réducteur des GTF Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 662529


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    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Poncho (Admin) Mar 23 Aoû 2011 - 14:13

    Bonjour à tous

    QQ news

    projet figé fin 2012
    Premier vol 2014
    certif 2016
    Livraisons 2017...
    Ca laisse du temps entre le premier vol et la livraison ...

    A noter que le MS21-400 n'est pas figé à l'heure actuelle, il a été présentés avec une aile plus grande et des winglets différents
    Le fuselage est me semble t'il plus long que celui de l'A321

    A suivre cet avion qui semble être couvé par les uns (techniciens) et les autres (politiques)


    ...


    Irkut, which valued the contracts overall at $6 billion, remains optimistic that it will be able to complete the final design phase of the MS-21 narrowbody by the end of 2012.
    The first flight of the aircraft remains on track for 2014, with certification scheduled to be completed in 2016 and deliveries to begin in 2017, said Irkut president Alexy Fedorov at the MAKS air show in Moscow.
    "The first aircraft will be the -200 and -300 variants, as that is where there is the most demand. We will decide on the timeline for the -400 later," he added.
    Irkut will start working on a concept for the -400 after it ­completes the final design work for the smaller variants of the ­narrowbody. It displayed a model of the -400 at MAKS, with a larger wing, winglets and longer airframe than the other family ­members. It is likely to carry 212-230 passengers, and have a longer range, putting in the category of the Airbus A321 and Boeing 737-900ER.
    "The -400 will be very different, but we are still studying the concept and the market for the aircraft," said Fedorov. "Our focus is now on the -200 and -300, as we have firm orders for those."
    He admits the market would be tough for the MS-21, but believes there is sufficient demand.
    "This narrowbody market is the toughest, but it is also the ­biggest. There is room for another player that offers a competitive price and option. The MS-21 can hold its own as it will come out only one to two years after the A320neo," he said.
    The company envisages a market for 1,200 MS-21s.
    Rostekhnologii has also signed a strategic partnership agreement with United Aircraft, covering development of domestic airframes. The purpose of the pact is to "create competitive Russian aircraft", said Rostekhnologii, and secure 10% of the global sales in the civil market by 2025, with domestic suppliers providing at least 70% of the systems.Rostekhnologii and United Aircraft have identified four priority areas. These comprise new-technology aircraft - such as the Irkut MS-21 and Sukhoi Superjet - plus modernised types, like the Tupolev Tu-204SM, aircraft for the government and a segment including the updated Antonov An-124 and An-70.
    Their partnership comes in the wake of heavy criticism from the Russian government that the country's commercial air transport industry is weak, and unable to compete on the same scale as foreign manufacturers.
    The two sides will create "innovative products", featuring advanced engines, modular avionics and composite materials.
    The MS-21 project is entering its final design phase, with completion targeted for the end of 2012


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    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Poncho (Admin) Ven 26 Aoû 2011 - 12:57

    Bonjour à tous

    La caissons de voilure composite fabriqués par FACCS pour le MS21 ont été présentés
    http://www.facc.at/en/aktuelles/presse_detail.asp?id=149&titel=MAKS_Airshow:_composite_wing_box_supplied_by_FACC_for_the_new_MS-21_officially_unveiled

    qq extraits


    The MS-21 Wing Box Project is hugely important to FACC and represents a major challenge for our company because of the dimensions of the components," states Walter Stephan, Chairman of FACC AG. "With our involvement in this Russian medium-haul aircraft, we are creating access to a new and very promising market as well as climbing up the league table of suppliers of primary structures on aircraft."

    In December 2009 FACC - due to their pioneering role in the use of new resin infusion technology - had been chosen by Aerocomposit as a partner in the development and manufacture of the composite wing box. Under the agreement, FACC developed in cooperation with Aerocomposit a prototype of the new wing box with the aim of creating and testing a construction complete with a fully integrated fuel tank, which is both efficient and suitable for series production. Based on the Aerocomposit design, FACC carried out the developing, testing and selection of the materials and processes, as well as the final design. FACC was also responsible for the design and manufacturing of the production materials and tools as well as the production and testing of the wing box prototype. The dimensions and number of individual parts in the project present a challenge; a wing box prototype consists of six individual composite components as well as approximately 300 purchased parts and 9,000 fasteners.

    Ils parlent de wingbox ... mais je vois tout sauf le wingbox (caison central de voilure ?) Je vois plutôt la structure des ailes....

    A suivre


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    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Poncho (Admin) Jeu 23 Fév 2012 - 9:32

    Bonjour à tous

    Quelques nouvelles du MS21 ...et qq soucis sur les tests structuraux du caisson de voilure
    Un exemplaire n'a pas supporté la torture

    A priori la techno est spécifique et différente d'airbus et boeing : infusion sous vide



    http://www.ainonline.com/node/102644
    he all-composite wing box of Russia’s next-generation Irkut MC-21 narrowbody jetliner is back in testing, according to the Central Aerohydrodynamic Institute (TsAGI) near Moscow. In January the first wing box cracked under excessive loading, the institute reported, but in February the testing continued on the second specimen.


    A TsAGI spokeswoman told AIN that arrival of the third wing box was postponed from January to March to allow time to introduce changes reflecting earlier test results. The second specimen is to undergo a continuous cycle test, while the third will be subjected to a wide range of trials covering structural integrity, frequency and strength.

    Structural integrity and strength testing of the first specimen was intended to demonstrate mastery of the technology and its readiness for approval. The assembly was subjected to preliminary frequency and stiffness tests, and was also used in separate research examining the effects of wing damage typically seen in airline service.

    The MC-21’s wing boxes are manufactured by AeroComposite of Russia in cooperation with FACC of Austria under contract from Irkut and its parent, United Aircraft. The MC-21 wing was designed by AeroComposite and its subcontractor, the Sukhoi design bureau.

    The experimental prototypes are made of Prism EP2400/BNCF IMS 24K carbon-fiber reinforced plastics. Irkut chose untried “vacuum infusion” technology in 2010, hoping to avoid the higher manufacturing cost incurred by reliance on large autoclaves (as used for the Boeing 787 and Airbus A350 XWB).

    TsAGI is responsible for testing and issuing approvals for flight-testing of the MC-21 development prototypes, due to start in 2015. Also, the institute leads a multi-tiered scientific research effort on building “a comprehensive database on composite [airframe] parts.” Under a contract with Boeing, the institute conducted extensive composite structure research and testing for the 787 Dreamliner project.


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    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Beochien Jeu 23 Fév 2012 - 10:02

    Merci Poncho !

    Une évidente prise de risque technologique !
    Mais le sous vide est tentant, bien sûr, pas de bulles d'air ... mais à force de remplir tous les vides ... avec de la résine, hum, le poids peut grimper !

    Et en plus des formes de moules à modifier, si on veut renforcer ...
    Alors qu'avec le CFRP "Classic", pour renforcer, on rajoute qq couches avec le tape-layer !

    Et l'aile, elle est en composite à 100% nervures comprises ?
    Pas vu grand chose sur le sujet !

    JPRS
    Frequent Traveller
    Frequent Traveller
    Whisky Quebec


    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Frequent Traveller Jeu 23 Fév 2012 - 11:01

    J'imagine que la base fibrée des CFRP dont on fabriquera le wingbox du MC21 seront les fameux mêmes "nanotubes carbone" dont on veut réaliser l'Ascenseur Orbital; je crois que Sukhoi sont très versés dans ces technologies des matériaux de pointe ?/FT

    http://www.lepoint.fr/actu-science/un-ascenseur-spatial-pour-remplacer-la-navette-01-03-2011-1301008_59.php
    Beochien
    Beochien
    Whisky Charlie


    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Beochien Jeu 23 Fév 2012 - 11:33

    L'ascenseur , hum ça fait 20 ans que je le suis ... sans qu'il nebouge beaucoup
    Et mes 2 cents que dans 20 ans , il sera encore à terre !

    Les nanotubes carbones sont encore un peu trop courts , même pour assurer une meilleure conductivité des CFRP, ce que l'on attendait un peu !
    Mais ils peuvent renfocer un peu les résines et donc les pièces en fibre de carbone ...

    Pour les moulages sous vide en infusion ... procédé connu et en oeuvre Worldwide, il n'était pas appliqué jusqu'à maintenant dans de si grosses et complexes structures en aero !

    La différence, serait que dans les CFRP "Prépeg" la résine est déjà imprégnée dans les tissus , alors que dans l'infusion, la résine est injectée sous vide dans du "Tissus Carbone" Sec !

    JPRS
    Beochien
    Beochien
    Whisky Charlie


    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Beochien Lun 23 Avr 2012 - 17:43

    Allez, ça se promène depuis ce matin !

    Grande nouvelle, Irkut finit par commander son premier batch (100) de P&W GTF pour son MS-21 !
    11 M$ en prix publique !
    Vendus directement par le constructeur à ses clients Russes ???
    Bon, c'était à attendre quand même !
    Le contraire eut été étonnant, vu que l'vion est lancé avec le GTF !
    Pour 2016,(Avions pour 2017 ?? hum !)On ne parle pas des moteurs de certification ... peut être sur un autre contrat ...
    C'est à priori le frère jumeau du PW1100G, donc ça devrait sortir à l'heure assez facilement !

    --------------- Le lien et un extrait de RIA ------------


    http://en.ria.ru/business/20120423/172987001.html


    Russia's Irkut aircraft manufacturing corporation is to sign a $1.1 billion contract in mid-May with U.S. jet engine maker Pratt & Whitney for turbofans for its MS-21 airliner, Kommersant business daily reported on Monday.

    Irkut will sign the deal with Pratt & Whitney and ODK, the engine-making subsidiary of Russia's United Aircraft Corporation (UAC) on May 15 or 16. The deal may be worth over $1.1 billion at catalog prices, sources close to the companies told the paper.

    Irkut initially plans to order 100 engines from the two firms with delivery due from 2016. Pratt & Whitney and ODK may also set up joint engine production in Russia, the source said.
    -----

    JPRS
    aeroduO5
    aeroduO5
    Whisky Quebec


    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par aeroduO5 Sam 28 Avr 2012 - 16:40

    On dirait que PW ne prend aucun risque.

    Ils vendent un dérivé sans gros travail à faire dessus.

    Et à charge pour le constructeur de les vendre.
    Poncho (Admin)
    Poncho (Admin)
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    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Poncho (Admin) Sam 28 Avr 2012 - 18:35

    Effectivement !
    C'est pas courant


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    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Poncho (Admin) Mar 5 Juin 2012 - 14:48

    Bonjour à tous

    A priori c'est signé

    http://www.pw.utc.com/media_center/press_releases/2012/06_jun/06-05-2012_00001.asp


    MUNICH, GERMANY, June 5, 2012 – Pratt & Whitney and Russia’s Irkut Corporation today signed a definitive agreement to offer the Pratt & Whitney PurePower® PW1400G engine on Irkut’s MC-21 family of aircraft. This secures the PurePower engine as the only western powerplant offered on the new narrow body program. Pratt & Whitney and Irkut Corporation selected Short Brothers plc, a subsidiary of Bombardier Aerospace of Canada, as the exclusive nacelle provider for the PW1400G engine family. Pratt & Whitney is a division of United Technologies Corp. (NYSE:UTX). “Irkut Corporation” JSC is a part of “United Aircraft Corporation” JSC.

    Irkut is developing the MC-21 as a family of 150 to 210-passenger aircraft with first flight of the PurePower® PW1400G engined aircraft planned for 2015 and entry into service in 2017. The MC-21 series will feature jetliners with 25,000-32,000 pounds of thrust.

    “We are pleased to confirm our commitment to provide economic and environmental benefits to the MC-21 aircraft with the PurePower engine,” said Todd Kallman, president, Pratt & Whitney Commercial Engines. “This revolutionary engine family continues to meet all of our performance expectations and program milestones. The PurePower engine offers the best possible reduction in fuel burn, noise, emissions and operating costs to Irkut’s customers.”

    “We are proud to offer the Pratt & Whitney PurePower engine on our MC-21 family of aircraft. The engine makes our aircraft more competitive because it offers real savings for our customers,” said Alexey I. Fedorov, president, Irkut Corporation. “Lowering fuel costs is good for airline customers, and reducing the environmental impact of commercial aviation is good for everyone.”

    The PurePower PW1000G series engines use an advanced gear system allowing the engine’s fan to operate at a different speed than the low-pressure compressor and turbine. The combination of the gear system and an all-new advanced core deliver double-digit improvements in fuel efficiency, environmental emissions and noise.
    The PurePower engine family also shares common, advanced cores and feature flight proven, next-generation technology. The engine core consists of an ultra-efficient high-pressure compressor, a low-emissions combustor, and state of the art high-pressure turbine module.

    Donc le MS21 sera mis en service en 2017... j'avais dans un coin de ma tête 2016... mais je dois me tromper


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    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Beochien Mar 5 Juin 2012 - 15:16

    Tu ne te trompes pas , JF ! Le MS 21 vient de prendre 1 an de retard ... depuis février, je viens de vérifier !

    Un peu bizarre que P&W signe seulement maintenant ... comment travailler sur un moteur si ce n'est pas signé ???
    Une filiale Bombardier, fabricant de nacelles du MS21, c'est bien, ils ont peut être l'expérience ??
    Mais pas sûr que ce soit sans conflit d'intérêts qq part !
    En plus, de mémoire c'est Goodric/UTC qui fourni le C-Séries ! Bizarre ... j'aimerais comprendre !
    Bon, demander à Aircelle de faire indépendemment son boulot ... hum !


    De Wikip :

    Delayed delivery was announced by Dmitry Rogozin - vice-premier of Russian Government in charge of defense industry - on February 10, 2012, with first flights planned 2015-2016 and delivery planned 2020.[14] This was soon corrected as the first delivery remains scheduled in 2017. !

    JPRS
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    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Poncho (Admin) Mar 5 Juin 2012 - 15:29

    Et hop

    le C919 à la bourre, le Ms21 aussi


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    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Beochien Mar 5 Juin 2012 - 15:39

    Et Airbus qui se marre ... et qui mettra une couche de plus au A320NEO pour 2018 ... et seulement si nécessaire !
    C'est presque dommage ...
    Paul
    Paul
    Whisky Quebec


    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Paul Mar 5 Juin 2012 - 17:21

    Beochien a écrit:Une filiale Bombardier, fabricant de nacelles du MS21, c'est bien, ils ont peut être l'expérience ??
    Mais pas sûr que ce soit sans conflit d'intérêts qq part !
    En plus, de mémoire c'est Goodric/UTC qui fourni le C-Séries ! Bizarre ... j'aimerais comprendre !
    Bon, demander à Aircelle de faire indépendemment son boulot ... hum !

    JPRS

    Bonjour,

    En fait, Short Brother n'est pas une filiale de Bombardier mais est partie intégrante de Bombardier Aéronautique au même titre que Learjet, Canadair et De Havilland Canada. Pour ce qui est des nacelles, les irlandais ont une bonne expérience avec les nacelles des CF34 des CRJ (et des Challenger 600) et des BR710 des Global Express. Ils sont également présent sur les nacelles de Trent 700, IAE V2500 et les RB211.

    http://www.belfast.aero.bombardier.com/categories/70/engine-nacelles.aspx
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    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Poncho (Admin) Mar 5 Juin 2012 - 17:33

    Merci Paul


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    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Beochien Mar 5 Juin 2012 - 17:36

    Admin a écrit:Et hop

    le C919 à la bourre, le Ms21 aussi

    Oui, et juste ajouter un petit qq chose d'ici là ... et on est en 2018 !
    Et P&W tranquille, dans un fauteuil, CFMI aussi ...
    C'est bien pour Boeing et Airbus, pas trop de conflits de préséance chez les motoristes, les ordres de sortie deviennent clairs !

    A part celà, merci Paul des précisions ...

    Je reste un peu surpris que Aircell soit si peu ambitieux, comme pour aller présenter des offres en vraie compétition, comme le font beaucoup d'acteurs du groupe Safran ... Suspect
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    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Poncho (Admin) Mar 5 Juin 2012 - 17:44

    Beochien, une petite pensée aussi pour le Cseries qui a du coup un peu plus d'espace, même si le CS300 est un peu court vs un C919 ou MS21 ... mais ne sait-on jamais, un CS500 est possible ? (quelle échéance ?)


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    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Beochien Mar 5 Juin 2012 - 18:46

    Bon, Poncho !

    Je vois juste que les MC, à 6 rangs, vont arriver en ordre plutôt écheloné, pour ne pas dire dispersé !
    Les 5 Pax de front c'est autre chose ...
    Des marchés qui se superposent marginalement ...
    Un C séries 500 sera un "Plus Court Courrier" probablement, et un trés long avion (J'aime pas) !
    Ils vont réfléchir au PB, mais sans trop de résultats pour les C-100/300 , hum !!

    Il faut quand même reconnaître à Bombardier, que s'ils sont à l'heure ...c'est superbe et une vraie leçon à A et B !
    Ils ont leurs raisons pour ne pas trop lâcher les prix ...
    Chapeau qq part, ils méritent leur part de marché !

    JPRS
    Paul
    Paul
    Whisky Quebec


    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Paul Mer 6 Juin 2012 - 1:15

    Beochien a écrit:Un peu bizarre que P&W signe seulement maintenant ... comment travailler sur un moteur si ce n'est pas signé ???

    Bonjour,

    Le PW1400G sera très (voire quasi) similaire au PW1100G: Même diamètre, poussée presque identique, même Bypass ratio, le même nombre d'étages, etc.

    Voici quelques infos trouvé sur le site de PW :
    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Pw1100vspw1400

    Beochien a écrit:Une filiale Bombardier, fabricant de nacelles du MS21, c'est bien, ils ont peut être l'expérience ??
    Mais pas sûr que ce soit sans conflit d'intérêts qq part !
    En plus, de mémoire c'est Goodric/UTC qui fourni le C-Séries ! Bizarre ... j'aimerais comprendre !

    Ne pas oublier que Goodrich est (ou sera bientôt) dans la même famille que Pratt & Whitney (UTC). Une entente préalable (du genre retour d'ascenseur pour service rendu en temps opportun) entre Bombardier et PW lors de la sélection du PW1500G est très probable.

    Je soupçonne Wink que les nacelles fabriquées par Bombardier seront conçues par Goodrich et seront également très similaire à celles de l'A320neo.
    Beochien
    Beochien
    Whisky Charlie


    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Beochien Mer 6 Juin 2012 - 7:42

    Merci Paul, c'est clair !

    Pour le moteur, c'est le même, bon, ça on le savait ... ce qui m'étonnait c'est que Irkut ait pu se passer si longtemps de contrat "Moteur"...
    Pour la Nacelle, c'est trés bien vu, UTC fait dans la diplomatie Wink!
    Poncho (Admin)
    Poncho (Admin)
    Whisky Charlie


    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Poncho (Admin) Mer 6 Juin 2012 - 9:52

    Bon pour le MS21 ... PW a effectivement vendu la mèche

    http://www.flightglobal.com/blogs/flightblogger/2012/06/pratt-whitney-slips-news-of-ms.html


    _________________
    @avia.poncho
    Poncho (Admin)
    Poncho (Admin)
    Whisky Charlie


    Irkut MC-21 - Page 3 Empty Re: Irkut MC-21

    Message par Poncho (Admin) Mar 12 Juin 2012 - 16:12

    Bonjour

    Comme vu -> retard pour le MS21

    http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/pw-reveals-new-slip-for-ms-21-first-flight-372908/?cmpid=SOC%7CFGFG%7Ctwitterfeed%7CFlightglobal

    et quelques détails en plus


    "First flight of the PurePower PW1400G-engined aircraft [is] planned for 2015 and entry into service in 2017," it says.

    P&W has given few other details, saying only that the first flight date is accurate and that the company is planning to start testing the first PW1400G engine on the ground in 2014.

    Irkut had selected the PW1400G two years ago, but has only just finally signed a definitive agreement to offer the engine on the MS-21 family.

    P&W has also provided more information on the engine size and overall supply chain. Its sales brochure for the PW1400G lists the thrust range between 125kN (28,000lb-thrust) for the 150-seat MS-21-200 and 138kN for the 181-seat MS-21-300. Irkut is also planning to offer the 210-seat ­MS-21-400.

    But P&W lists the thrust range for the MS-21 family at 110-142kN. The manufacturer also says the engine nacelle for the MS-21 will be supplied by Bombardier's Belfast-based Short Brothers subsidiary.

    Short Brothers has previously supplied nacelles for the International Aero Engines V2500 and General Electric CF34 turbofans, but this is the first time the company has been selected for the geared turbofan application.

    Bombardier selected Goodrich to supply the nacelles for the PW1200-powered CSeries family.

    Irkut plans to complete the final design phase of the MS-21 before 1 January 2013. The aircraft is being designed to compete in a crowded narrowbody sector, with the Airbus A320neo, Boeing 737 Max, CSeries and Comac C919 also vying for orders.


    _________________
    @avia.poncho

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