A319/A320/A321 NEO Partie 1

Bonjour !

Un bon indicateur de NEO-tization future ??? Ou une incohérence Mktg totale chez Airbus!
Par les temps qui courent, je vote 2 !

Le CFM56 Evolution B... c'est certifié et en route pour le 737, 1,6% d'écos de conso, pour les vieux CFM56, c'est toujours ça...
Parfaitement transférable sur les A320 ... ça n'a intéressé personne à commencer par Airbus ???
Alors ... mis de côté because le A320 NEO ?? , c'était idiot, le NEO étant une option, il faut quand même respecter les clients, ne pas les manipuler, sinon ils finissent par s'en rendre compte, et votent avec leurs pieds !
Et maintenant que fait on ?? Si on l'annonce, ce 1,6%, on donne l'impression d'enterrer le NEO, si on ne l'annonce pas ... ben les clients attendront que ça vienne , ou iront voir ailleurs !
Le mktg du A320, tous les jours plus génial ...

Un extrait de wikipedia sur le CFM56, et en anglais

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CFM_International_CFM56
CFM56-7B "Evolution"

In 2009, CFMI announced the latest upgrade to the CFM56 engine, the "CFM56-7B Evolution" or CFM56-7BE. This upgrade, announced alongside Boeing's newest 737 variant, further enhances the high- and low-pressure turbines with better aerodynamics, as well as improving engine cooling, and aims to reduce overall part count.^[30]

CFMI expected the changes to result in a 4% reduction in maintenance costs and a 1% improvement in fuel consumption (2% improvement including the airframe changes for the new 737); however, flight and ground tests completed in May 2010 revealed that the fuel burn improvement was better than expected at 1.6%.^[31] Following 450 hours of testing, the CFM56-7BE engine was certified by FAA and EASA on July 30, 2010.^[32]

While the CFM56-7BE engine is designed specifically for Boeing's new 737, CFMI have proposed a similar Evolution upgrade for the CFM56-5B engines that power Airbus's A320. As of May 2010, Airbus has not made any commitment to a new engine.



JPRS!

Et pourquoi ne pas lire ceci:
http://www.aeromorning.com/chroniques.php?ch_id=822
http://jr.skynetblogs.be/archive/2010/10/01/remotorisation-de-la-famille-a320.html

Beochien a écrit:Bonjour !
Bruno Trédévic, est un peu plus clair dans les Echos, sans révéler ses sources ...

Bien , c'est un peu plus développé ! l'affaire du NEO, et chacun à sa place !
John Leahy qui pousse !
Et Tomas Ender qui freine à fond !
Mais ... ramener le PB à une histoire de capital risque à partager à la dernière minute... Ne pas prendre les gens pour des idiots SVP !
- Personne et aucune alliance ne remplaceront les heures d'ingés si ils ne sont pas disponibles ... pas de génération "spontanée" possible sur le sujet ni d'externalisation ce sont les équipes qui sont sur les "Sharklets" et les ailes, qui doivent s'en charger !
- Et si UN motoriste se lance dans le projet en capital-risque ... ben que fera l'autre motoriste ???
- Ce ne sont pas un milliard d'€ qui vont arrêter Airbus ... l'enjeu est infiniment plus grave et important !!
- Et mettre en place une usine à gaz contractuelle, avant la fin de l'année, à partir du scratch ... mon œil !

Donc, la vérité SVP ... même à travers l'écran de fumée généré par Airbus, ils y vont ou pas ... le reste c'est de la daube ...
Et tout ça, ressemble de plus en plus à du cinema pour expliquer dans 2 mois, que l'on a pas pu y arriver pour xx raisons, alors que c'est déjà décidé !
On se fout du monde gratos, chez Airbus !
Et les âneries lancées par les Echos sont bien loin de me convaincre ! Info-Intox sais pas ... mais ça ne sonne pas juste ...


----------------- Le lien !-----------------
http://www.lesechos.fr/entreprises-secteurs/air-defense/actu/020882469953-airbus-cherche-un-allie-pour-lancer-l-a320-remotorise.htm

JPRS

Salut Beochien

C'est repris ici

http://www.iag-inc.com/2010/10/26/airbus-plays-an-interesting-card/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+blogspot%2FtAHS+%28IAGblog+feed%29

Les Echos has a great story here. It appears Airbus is still interested in the NEO but wants to offset the risk by bringing in a partner. It seems Airbus thinks an NEO will require five years of engineering to the wing box and landing gear. This is because both the LEAP-X and GTF are heavier engines.

The risk of the NEO seems to be holding Airbus back. None of the items mentioned are insurmountable. However, the delays experienced with other programs have clearly left their mark. There is a real fear that extending resources is just too much. It may be that Boeing has come to the same conclusion.

However the decision to delay re-engine plans also carries a risk. Which is why the whole story is fascinating. If Airbus and Boeing decide to do nothing, they are essentially going to have to concede precious market share built over decades. Bombardier is going to pick up critical mass and then is likely to develop an even bigger version of its CS. The question facing the OEMs is this; what costs more, developing an NEO or doing nothing? In truth doing nothing needs to be qualified – it means doing nothing to current programs even as they start work on replacements set for 2025 to 2030.

If you give Bombardier a two decade window, what happens? Boeing seems to be willing to take the risk that they can close that gap well before two decades and hold off Bombardier in the interim. Airbus seems less certain about this and wants an engine maker to help reduce the risk and development cost. This is a clever strategy – but who are they wooing? Pratt & Whitney and CFM obviously. P&W has an engine but may not be so keen to invest in Airbus's program. CFM might be more interested but still has a long way to go to get an engine ready. CFM might have its hand forced though, it has an engine on the A320 and is exclusive on the 737. For them the risk is losing this status – does it have the resources Airbus needs?

5 ans pour le NEO !
C'est long punaise...

Merci Poncho !

Surpoids ... bof peut être pas tant que cela, qq renforts pour l'aile, probable, la wing box, peut être aussi !
Tout cela est déjà en chantier pour les sharklets pour 2012, il n'y aurait pas un grand délai à tout traiter ensemble !

Pour le train, la j'applaudis, il est déjà un peu juste, voire obsolète, et pas costaud, (Ou déjà trop chargé) ce ne serait pas un mal, et un nouveau train devrait être plus léger, en plus, c'est à 90% dans le camp de Safran !
Mais ... dans 5 ans, c'est un peu exagéré , à mon avis, sauf si on commence en 2012 !

Et ceux qui exagèrent ... ben, c'est une intox qui les arrange bien, Airbus, Tomas Enders ne va pas les contredire !

JPRS

Le train ?
Est-ce le même entre un A318 et un A321 ?

bon là c'est sur

Bonjour !
L'AirInsight de Ernest Arvai, à ajouter au dossier !
Bien à lire, une com de plus, sauf peut être une objection ...
2018, ben pour arranger RR, ce serait bien !
Mais c'est trop tard pour une re-motorisation !
Rappel quand même le leapX pour les Chinois sera certifié en 2014, et sera pratiquement dans la même puissance, que celle du A320, et de même dimension, les nacelles etc seront les mêmes aussi !
Et tout laisse penser que le LeapX complet, pourrait être certifié pour 2016 sur un A320 !

Aucun intérêt pour 2018, ce serait suicidaire, c'est 2015-2016 ou rien, pour Airbus, juste à mon avis !

--------------

Airbus NEO Decision will be Based on Strategic Partners and Euro Politics Ernest Arvai | October 26, 2010 at 10:45 am |

---------------- l'article AirInsight ---------------------

http://airinsight.wordpress.com/2010/10/26/airbus-neo-decision-will-be-based-on-strategic-partners-and-euro-politics/

Airbus decision on the NEO has been delayed as it attempts to obtain additional funding from the engine manufacturers, and the timing of the LEAP-X engine from CFM International, the full version of which may be delayed to 2018
Airbus, and John Leahy, have been touting the A320NEO re-engining program as an interim solution until a new aircraft can be developed in the 2025 time frame that takes advantage of new open rotor technologies. With either the PW GTF or CFM International LEAP-X engines, a 15% improvement in fuel burn could be expected, which should translate to operating cost savings of 6-8% prior to capital costs, fuel being just under half of operating costs.

Boeing has criticized the program, indicating that after capital costs, only an incremental gain of 3-5% would remain. Airlines however, for whom a 1% difference in costs can mean the difference between profit and loss, remain interested in an aircraft with 15% lower fuel burn.

Airbus has two critical issues holding up the decision to move forward with the NEO. The first is capital. Airbus delays with the A380 program, which has still not achieved high production rates, have cost it dearly, and the new technology A350XWB program, using carbon fiber technologies, will require a substantial investment over the next three years. With launch aid now under scrutiny from the WTO, Airbus must find additional capital for new programs.

At the same time, Airbus engineering resources must be focused on bringing the A350XWB to market on time, as the company must learn from its own A380 shortcomings as well as Boeing’s troubles with the much-delayed 787 program. EADS has indicated that it will not shortchange the A350XWB program in order to complete the NEO program.

So where does Airbus come up with the resources to complete the program.? Now it is looking to the engine manufacturers, who stand to gain through additional engine sales should the program move forward. Airbus is actively in risk sharing discussions with the engine manufacturers, each of which can’t afford to ignore about half of the current narrow-body market.Pratt & Whitney, with its innovative GTF engine, would replace IAE as an engine supplier for the A320 family, and achieve full revenues rather than the 40% position they share with Rolls-Royce on the IAE program. This would be another win for the GTF program, already selected by Bombardier for the CSeries, Irkut for the MS-21, and Mitsubishi for the MRJ. As PW has no current position on the Boeing 737 series and a re-engining is unlikely, it will need to wait for Boeing’s all new program in 2020 to compete.

CFM International, which is already well positioned on the aircraft, needs a western platform for its LEAP-X engine, currently only selected for the COMAC C919. However, the full version of the LEAP-X, originally scheduled for 2016, will likely now not be available until 2018, with a less capable version provided to COMAC for initial C919 production.


The LEAP-X, which is utilizing similar technology to the GE90 and GEnx wide body engines, will likely be delayed in providing its full 15%-16% fuel burn reduction until the second version of the engine, with only 10%-12% fuel savings from the LEAP-X 1C model in 2016 when the NEO program would be scheduled to begin, and the 15%-16% on the more advanced LEAP-X 2C model in 2018.

However, with only 10 years between introduction of the NEO and a likely new model from Airbus in the 2026-2027 time frame, and additional two year delay for the LEAP-X-2C would provide only an eight year production run, further complicating the economics for the re-engining program.

Of course, since CFM is a joint venture of GE and France’s SNECMA unit of SAFRAN, politics may also come into play. If the French partner is delayed, would Airbus move forward with only the American firm (albeit MTU participates in the GTF program)? With the MTU participation in the PW GTF program, it is likely that the German and French factions in Airbus may be supporting different decisions.

The bottom line will come down to economic contributions and how hungry the engine manufacturers are for customers to launch their new technologies. It is likely that if one engine manufacturer moves forward, the other will need also move forward from a competitive standpoint. Pratt & Whitney appears to be in the driver’s seat - having a timing advantage over CFM. If they choose to gain market share at Airbus and invest in the program, CFM will need to react in the near term - but won’t have the advanced technology engine ready in time to successfully compete.

Bien,

Fernando Alonso (Senor VP Airbus, pas un pilote de F1) essaye de les trier côté Ailes, NEO et Sharklets, sans vraiment me convaincre ... mais ça va dans le bon sens, en lisant entre les lignes du moins ..
Le Vieux proto bien fatigué du A320, MSN1, portera des winglets, sans ... trop de garanties, visiblement juste pour voir l'aero, valider et essayer sans trop le fatiguer le pauvre, destination la casse, après !
Un nouvel avion servira après pour les vrais test, avec le Wing Box renforcé, etc ... juste en démarrant la série "Sharklets" (Fin 2011, ou début 2012) Ce devrait être à terme, le prochain A320 d'essais (Pour essayer quoi au fait, à part les winglets .... ?? )

Mais bien sûr on vous jure, et presque trop souvent (Ya des consignes visibles ) que cela n'a rien à voir avec le NEO, et pourtant le Fernando, il le nomme à chaque ligne, et cette annonce sort juste qq jours après la réunion à Filton, avec T Enders ... et ses doutes !

Bon, Airbus voudrait préparer discrètement l'aile du A320, à recevoir et essayer les moteurs NEO, et se donner aussi le temps de recevoir toutes les "Vraies" données "Motoristes" dans les mois à venir, en particulier, poids et centrages définitifs......
Eh bien, il ne s'y prendraient pas autrement chez Airbus !

Noter que ce serait fin 2015, pour le NEO, une date qui me plaît bien !

A part cela on attend toujours l'annonce des 1,6 % d'écos sur le CFM56 .. Hou Hou Airbus ... c'est annoncé chez Boeing depuis 6 mois !
Evidemment, est ce opportun dans le cadre (Eventuel) du NEO, d'annoncer que le CFM progresse un peu ..... ça, c'est du mktg à la JL ! Juste une impression perso sous jacente ...

Bon, comprenne qui pourra, jusqu'à la prochaine d'Airbus, peut être dans le sens contraire !

------------------ L'article de Aviation Week -----------------

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story.jsp?id=news/awx/2010/10/26/awx_10_26_2010_p0-265318.xml&headline=Sharklet%20A320%20Will%20Be%20Baseline%20For%20NEO%20Version%20&channel=comm



By Max Kingsley-Jones kingsley.jones@aviationweek.com
SEVILLE, Spain

Airbus will use the forthcoming A320 variant equipped with sharklet winglets as the benchmark or baseline airframe for the New Engine Option (NEO) derivative that is expected to be launched by year-end.

Airbus’s senior vice president flight and integration test, Fernando Alonso, says that the first production sharklet A320, which is due to fly in 2012 and deliver a 3.5% fuel burn improvement, will be used as the reference for the NEO version. Subject to the expected launch this year, the NEO is due to follow two-to-three years after the sharklet version flies. However, Alonso adds that there are no plans to re-engine the sharklet test A320 as a NEO development aircraft.
The NEO variant will be aerodynamically similar to the sharklet-equipped A320, but will be powered by advanced turbofans — either the CFM Leap-X or Pratt & Whitney geared turbofan — which should provide a double-digit gain in fuel efficiency. It is due to enter service in late 2015.

Although the sharklets will be tested on the company’s 23 year-old A320 test aircraft MSN1, Alonso says the bulk of the development work will have to be undertaken by the first production sharklet aircraft. “MSN1 is too old. The production aircraft will also have the revised wing structure that is required for the sharklets,” he says.
The aging test aircraft, which was the first A320 built and has been used for flight trials in Toulouse since 1987, will be replaced with one of the new prototype airframes, he adds. “MSN1 will be retired. We’ll keep the first sharklet A320 for testing or if we go ahead with NEO then we would retain the first one of those,” says Alonso.

Air New Zealand became the launch customer for the sharklet A320 in November last year. Deliveries are due to begin in late 2012.

JPRS

Bonjour

La dernière compilation de Jon Ostrower sur les NEO, Airbus, Boeing, Bombardier ; et toutes les options ....

C'est long et bien fait, tout est vu y compris les moteurs , manquent juste les précisions, pour les EIS de options NEO ... pas de boule de cristal chez JO non plus !!


------------A lire sur FlightGlobal Le lien : ----------------

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2010/11/02/349054/world-airliners-narrowing-the-options.html

JPRS

Juste une réflexion ...

Les cdes de A320, et de 737, continuent de s'empiler ... la prochaine d'Airbus, sera pour la ligne d'assemblage Chinoise !
Mais ... Cela tombe encore pour des livraisons trés possibles avant 2016 ...
Les +/- 2200 MC en cde de chaque côté sont parfaitement "Fabricables" pour 2016, au rythme cumulé de 800 MC / An !

Noter, juste au passage que depuis presque 3 ans, les livraisons sont supérieures aux prises de cdes et le "Backlog" des MC, bien que très confortable, ben il descend petit à petit !
C'est un indicateur, comme un autre, des inquiétudes du business , bien sûr, mais peut être aussi la venue des nouveaux "Airframers" qui ont les dents longues !
2016, verra la venue des COMAC, MS21, et du CSéries 130 !

L'option NEO, chez Airbus, comme chez Boeing, reste donc parfaitement "Manageable" et remplir un carnet de commandes avec des NEO, pour à partir de 2016, reste très possible ...
C'est un changement de type, comme celui du B737 NG dans les années "90" et dont personne ne s'est plaint que je sache, même pas les lessors, qui devraient bien se décider à vivre avec leur temps, au lieu de traîner les pieds !

C'était ma réflexion, surtout après relecture des cdes MC en cours, sur le post de Jon Ostrower !

Donc un "Timing" bien précis, 2015-16, et défense de se louper, chez les airframers, comme chez les motoristes, et par les temps qui courent ... une réflexion de plus, il y a encore du temps mais pas trop ... !

JPRS

Merci Beochien pour ta réflexion qui peut correspondre à la réalité, mais si tel est le cas, je me demande bien à quel prix BOC a eu ses 30 derniers 320. Prendre des appareils fin de série (+ sharklet), je les négocierai sérieusement.

Bon concernant les chinois, ils ne vont pas avoir trop de mal à les fourguer...

En plus demain, le président chinois va venir en France avec des commandes dans les valises....

Merci Art-Way !
Ben tu sais, c'est part de la démarche politique le timing de la cde BOC ... Qui d'ailleurs ne va pas forcément les louer en Chine ... c'est du business Asiatique au sens large, pour l'instant !
De plus, fin de série ou pas ... qui sait, le flou artistique est maintenu par Airbus Normal ... pour qq semaines encore !
Et des avions, ben il en ont besoin les Chinois et toute la zone, 2016, c'est dans 5 ans, il faut bien vivre en attendant les NEO ou surtout les COMAC'S, dont on peut se demander s'ils seront à l'heure et combien ils pourront produire les premières années !
Et ... les 40-45 % de remise, ça peut toujours aider ... surtout si les motoristes les appliquent aussi, je sens d'ailleurs que la cde BOC, n'a pas du être négocié "Séparément" de ce qui vient, pour les prix, du moins !

Au fait, quels sont les moteurs choisis par BOC ??

JPRS

BOC Aviation sont informés (comme beaucoup d'autres) de l'intérêt qu'il peut y avoir à se faire réserver une flexibilité contractuelle dans leur nouvelle relation de commande avec Airbus pour redécliner une partie de leurs 30 positions (dont une partie sur 2014, 15 ou 16) en livraisons éventuelles de la série-projet A320H, au cas où ce projet verrait le jour, ce qu'il serait imprudent d'exclure. Les termes de la communication (par TwinAisleFeeders) sont reproduits ci-après :

Our most serious contender for near term application in the "SMR Feeder" market could well be a stretched A321HQR (TwinAisleFeeders have dubbed it the A322HQR), featuring FOUR underbelly Cargo Doors, one fwd and one aft of the FWD cargo compartment, then again one fwd and one aft of the AFT cargo compartment, dividing automised container handling times FOURFOLD at Airport ground rotations, whilst the pax flow upstairs - with (1+3+1) seating at capacities equal to A321 (3+3), ie tentatively TBC : 185 pax @ 32" (37 rows) - is shortened by TWICE 7' to 9', with quicker Cleaning, allowing for Airport Rotation Planning SLOT TIMES from 'brakes on' to 'push-back' of 28' to 35' pending Cabin Factor, ie MINUS 22' to MINUS 15' per each airport ground rotation, vs typical routine 50' planning slot times for A321 or 737NG-900 in the standard (3+3) cabin layout.

Times six (!! in a typical 24h day), this gives a target 120' extra time made available for flying, which give one extra flight/24h up to TWO EXTRA FLIGHTS/24h, pending operator's average leg times, identifying the A322HQR as the potential n° 1 future SMR Feeder Work-Horse... TwinAisleFeeders are pushing very hard for Airbus to develop this variant. BOC Aviation will be aware of the tantalising "RoRo" efficiency of such a potential vector (Roll-On/Roll-Off, from Shipping, a high-performance logistic tool keen to Singapour shippers !) specially well adapted for scheduled AirBridge shuttle ops and as an "anti-LCC" weapon, for Majors to win the battle against SWA, easyJet, Asiana and others, resolutely putting up with PRODUCT DIFFERENTIATION instead of meekly re-aligning to LCC, which could equate to skinning off your own hide.

Below "Hagbard" (Hägar, by Dik Browne) comic strip gives you a taste of doing business with A322HQR : "Life needn't be EITHER-OR - let's make it BOTH-AND !!" says Hägar, the Terrible Wiking.

https://i.servimg.com/u/f63/15/83/64/75/hagbar11.jpg



De cette manière, BOC Aviation, comme d'autres tels ALC, United (UAL+CoAir), US Airways, APM Corporate Finance, ... (la liste est longue !) pourraient choisir de surprendre le marché le moment venu, sans laisser le temps à la concurrence de réagir

Bonjour !

Le coût de l'indécision pour Airbus, certainement battus cette année, par Boeing pour les prises de cdes !
Airbus paye le prix fort côté cdes de MC !
Une 30taine de 737, vu today pour Gol de mémoire !

2 contre 1 pour dans les MC en faveur du 737, depuis le début de l'année !
Pour le 737, qui promet ... 2 % dans 2 ans, VS Airbus qui promet entre rien et 15 %... pour dans 5 Ans !

Je considère que les Sharklets sont seulement un rattrappage tardif !


Le prix à payer pour la valse-hésitation de Tomas Enders !

John Leahy doit râler ...

------------ La com de Bloomberg, Extrait ! ----------

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-11-15/boeing-may-win-in-2010-orders-on-737-as-airbus-waffles-on-a320.html

Boeing May Win in 2010 Orders on 737 as Airbus Waffles on A320
By Susanna Ray - Nov 15, 2010 6:01 AM GMT+0100

Boeing Co. may be headed for its first victory in aircraft orders in three years, buoyed by demand for the 737 jet as larger rival Airbus SAS defers a decision on whether to offer a new engine on its A320.

Boeing booked 480 net orders through October, compared with Airbus’s 369. Chicago-based Boeing’s total includes 432 for the 737, almost twice as many as Airbus’s 217 for the A320, and was boosted by another three jets in an update last week.

The 787 Dreamliner’s flight-test suspension after a fire last week spotlighted the importance of the 737, the world’s most widely flown jetliner. While the 787 has racked up record advance orders, it has lost four more than it won in 2010, and Boeing isn’t getting revenue because the first delivery is almost three years behind schedule.

“The 737 is a high-volume, high-profit machine,” said Richard Aboulafia, an analyst at Teal Group, an aerospace consulting firm in Fairfax, Virginia.

Delivery of the 787 has been delayed six times, and Sanford C. Bernstein’s Doug Harned predicted a seventh, which he said will pressure Boeing’s earnings margins. The New York-based analyst, who rates the company’s shares “market perform,” told clients in a note last week he expects Boeing to keep boosting 737 output and post higher profits on the plane.

Airlines are responding positively to Boeing’s firm signal that it will develop a new plane rather than extend the 737’s life with a new engine, said Aboulafia. Airbus has said for more than a year it wants new engines on the A320 as an interim step until the technology is ready for a replacement, without making a commitment.

‘Big Advantage’

Boeing’s stiffer stance “just might win some market share until all the confusion is cleaned up,” Aboulafia said “It’s OK to have that uncertainty for a couple of weeks, but do this all year? That’s what gives the other guy a big advantage.”

Airbus, based in Toulouse, France, has held back on committing on the A320, saying it’s not sure it has the resources while engineers work on the super jumbo A380, twin- aisle A350 and A400M military transport.

Chris Jones, vice president of sales for Airbus in North America, said the company intends to decide on the A320 by the end of December. He said that deliberations won’t stretch into 2011, as United Technologies Corp. Chief Executive Officer Louis Chenevert on Nov. 3 said could happen. United Technologies’ Pratt & Whitney unit makes engines for the A320.
_____________

JPRS

Est-ce inquiétant ?

En attendant Leahy remet le NOE sur le bruleur de la gazinière en affichant PW et CFM comme partenaires

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/blogs/commercial_aviation/ThingsWithWings/index.jsp?plckController=Blog&plckBlogPage=BlogViewPost&newspaperUserId=7a78f54e-b3dd-4fa6-ae6e-dff2ffd7bdbb&plckPostId=Blog%3a7a78f54e-b3dd-4fa6-ae6e-dff2ffd7bdbbPost%3aed8b7dc8-b149-42e4-aca1-a572d98c89d0&plckScript=blogScript&plckElementId=blogDest

Qui étiait à l'EADS Investor Forum 2010 toulouse ?
Qui a le diaporama complet ?

L'article

Airbus has made public a detailed illustration of what the re-engined A320 New Engine Option could look like. The airframer also appears to be ruling out an International Aero Engines offering, siding with the joint venture’s partner Pratt & Whitney for its geared turbofan.



The graphic is featured in a slide from the presentation given by Airbus’s chief operating officer customers John Leahy at this week’s EADS investor forum in Toulouse. According to the graphic, the NEO will be equipped with new engines from CFM International and Pratt, offering an increase in bypass ratio from five in today’s powerplants to between nine and 12. It also says that the engine fan diameters will increase from around 64 in. Currently to up to 81 in.
Airbus expects the new engines will offer a 15% reduction in specific fuel consumption, as well as lower noise levels. Additionally, the A320 family’s “Sharklet” winglets will deliver another 3.5% improvement in fuel burn, as well as better field performance, over today’s Airbus single-aisles.
Although CFM and Pratt’s logos appear on the NEO slide, it gives no mention to Pratt’s IAE joint venture with Rolls-Royce, which had been Airbus’s favoured option for the GTF offering to keep supplier commonality with today’s A320s.
The manufacturer hopes to take a decision to launch the NEO upgrade before the end of 2010, with the aim of delivering the first aircraft in five years.

Bonne journée

Bonjour à tous,

IAE.....

Airbus reveals A320 NEO plans
By Alan Dron

Airbus has offered a glimpse of its proposed A320 New Engine Option (NEO) - which appears to leave International Aero Engines out in the cold. John Leahy, the EADS-owned airframer's chief salesman, unveiled an artist's impression of the re-engined narrowbody during a presentation at an EADS investor forum in Toulouse,A slide exhibiting the aircraft outlines targeted efficiency gains over the current A320. The NEO would have a fuel burn around 15% lower than variants now in production. The bypass ratio would increase from five in the present generation of engines to between nine and 12. Fan diameter rises from around 1,600mm (64in) to 2,025mm (81in).

EADS

The logos of powerplant manufacturers CFM International and Pratt & Whitney are prominent on the slide. Noticeably absent is that of IAE, a consortium in which P&W is partnered with Rolls-Royce, Japanese Aero Engine and MTU Aero Engines. Airbus predicts a 15% reduction in specific fuel consumption from the new engines, and says its new sharklet winglets will add 3.5% in fuel-burn savings on long sectors, as well as improving field performance and noise levels.

Merci Art Way !

Cette photo, se promène depuis qq semaines, voire depuis Farnborough sous diverses formes (ISTAT Munich d'aprés A.net) !
Et en Chine, les motoristes (Surtout CFM, Et les Chinois) considèrent le 320 NEO comme acquis Ouarf!

Bon, ils n'ont peut être rien compris, les Chinois, aux subtilités des charges d'entreprise de EADS, côté engineering, la Chine produisant, elle, 1 million d'ingénieurs par an !

Une marche arrière qui pourrait être bien difficile pour Airbus ...
Et pour moi, un John Leahy qui alimente discrètement le feu côté clients ...

Assez rigolo tout ça comme intox, les clients de lancement doivent être prêts depuis longtemps !
Ca ne va pas pouvoir durer bien longtemps, ce jeu !!


J'ajoute aussi ...
Depuis que RR est dans la M...e jusqu'au cou, les autres Motoristes, ont joué le jeu du respect ... très discrets dans les annonces !
Y compris et surtout P&W qui ne communique plus, surtout pas du côté de la guerre des brevets !

j'ajoute encore!
je ne l'avais pas vu sous l'éclairage de Jon Ostrower !
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2010/11/18/349865/airbus-reveals-a320-neo-plans.html

Et John Leahy faisant son agit prop à Pékin!
De plus en plus intéressant !
Ca va chauffer en réunions, de retour à Toulouse ... si le A380 leur laisse un peu de temps !

Noté le diamètre de 81 pouces, pour le GTF je pense ! Et le MS21 ??

Petite scène bientôt à Toulouse !

JL : Moi je vend le NEO ...et d'abord, il est déjà vendu !

T.E: Moi je ne peut pas le développer, pas d'ingés, Grrr !

F.B: Moi j'aime pas les risques, ni ceux qui en prennent

L.G: Ma retraite, c'est 2012, amusez vous bien les jeunes !

Allez bon courage , on l'aura ce NEO ! Si JL le veut si fort !

JPRS

Bonjour !

Et Tony Fernandez y va de son coup de gueule, pour Air Asia !
Possible client de lancement du A320 NEO ??
Un concert asiatique pour le NEO (Au fait ou est JL ??)
Bien orchestrée cette agitation, et Tomas Enders, il à du se mettre les boules Kies !


--------------- L'article de Bloomberg ----------------------

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-11-18/airasia-hopes-for-airbus-decision-on-re-engined-a320-this-year.html

AirAsia Hopes for Airbus Decision on Re-engined A320 This Year
By Laurence Frost - Nov 18, 2010 12:51 PM GMT+0100


AirAsia CEO Tony Fernandes

AirAsia Chief Executive Officer Tony Fernandes. Photographer: Fabrice Dimier/Bloomberg

AirAsia wants Airbus to decide this year whether to offer a re-engined version of its A320 single- aisle jet, Chief Executive Officer Tony Fernandes said.

“We need airbus to hurry up and make a decision -- I hope by the end of the year,” Fernandes said in an interview in Paris.

“Both Airbus and Boeing have taken a long time deciding about the next generation” of short-haul jets. “If they wait any longer there’s going to be competition from Embraer, Bombardier and the Chinese.”

To contact the editor responsible for this story: Laurence Frost at lfrost4@bloomberg.net


JPRS

Salut à tous

Salut Beochien

Pour te faire plaisir et que tu passes un bon We

http://atwonline.com/aircraft-engines-components/news/bernstein-sees-airbus-tilting-against-a320-re-engine-1118

Bernstein Research believes that Airbus may have cooled on the re-engine of its A320 aircraft, becoming “increasingly hesitant based on challenges associated with resource availability,” a situation flagged by the group in October (ATW Daily News, Oct. 6).

“While we have expected Airbus to re-engine, it appears that Airbus is laying the groundwork to back away from that decision,” Bernstein noted. In a client report, the New York based-research group said that Airbus management will make the "no or no-go" decision before the end of this year.

The research group noted that the hurdle for Airbus is ensuring that adequate resources are available to do the re-engine at the same time as the company continues to see engineering talent stretched on the A350, A400M and A380. “This issue has not yet been resolved and has engendered more concern over the last several months. The challenge for Airbus is not total engineering resources or dollars but specific types of highly skilled engineers, which include engineers experienced in wing design and stress—always a scarce resource,” Bernstein noted.

Bernstein said that Airbus management sees customer feedback as positive and the business case as attractive. The company has completed preliminary agreements with both engine manufacturers. “Both engine manufacturers—CFM and Pratt & Whitney—have appeared cautiously optimistic that Airbus will go ahead. We believe the ultimate decision will depend on the tolerance for risk among Airbus top management,” it said.

“But with A320 sales likely to continue for some time even without the NEO [New Engine Option] there is very little downside to not doing the re-engine.” For Boeing, a "no-go" decision by Airbus on the NEO would be the best outcome and it may well be the best outcome for Airbus, suggested Bernstein.

The research group believes that transition to the NEO will deliver the premium price of $7 million to $8 million per aircraft that Airbus hopes for but believes all it will do is help Airbus in deals over Boeing’s 737NG.

Bon
Ca serait financièrement rentable de le faire
Les clients seraient preneur

Mais.... manque de ressources humaines

Greuh..

Merci Poncho !
je l'avais vu , mais il est divulgué seulement cette semaine!
Après avoir été écrit début Octobre !

Pas facile à suivre le NEO en ce moment, hors s'amuser à spéculer un peu !

Je mise sur le plus malin ! John Leahy !

S'il ne démissionne pas, c'est que le A320 NEO va sortir !

Bonsoir

Leahy a dit que le NEO sera proposé sans qu'il n'y ait besoin de commande de lancement...

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story.jsp?id=news/awx/2010/11/19/awx_11_19_2010_p0-271320.xml&headline=Airbus May Launch NEO Without Big Order&channel=comm

The go-ahead of Airbus’s A320 New Engine Option (NEO) upgrade will not be conditional on any big order target or customer mix as has been the traditional pre-requisite for previous program go-aheads. And catalogue prices for the upgraded variants will have a premium of upward of $8 million, depending on the engine selected, the manufacturer reveals.

A decision whether to go ahead with the NEO is due by the end of this year. But it is concern over the availability of Airbus’s engineering resources to develop the project, rather than the upgrade’s commercial prospects, that will drive the decision, says Chief Operating Officer John Leahy.

“The board is not looking for big [order] numbers — if we have the industrial launch then it will be the ATO [authority to offer] at the same time,” Leahy told an EADS investor forum in Toulouse on Nov. 16. “It will not be ‘bring back 200 orders from five customers and then we’ll think about it.’”

Leahy says he sees little value in the traditional program launch pre-requisite of a specified number of orders and customers. “You go out and give them special pricing and it just proves what you already knew,” he says.

Leahy says that it is not the intention to have customers holding existing A320 orders convert them to the NEO. It is also unlikely that any orders for the new variant will be in the backlog in 2010, as any launch announcement is unlikely until the very end of the year.

Central to the NEO upgrade are new advanced turbofans from CFM (Leap-X) and Pratt & Whitney (geared turbofan). Combined with “Sharklet” winglets, Airbus claims the NEO upgrade will offer up to a 15% reduction in fuel burn over the current A320.

Airbus now has apparently given up on its preferred option for Pratt to offer the GTF through its existing A320 engine partnership with Rolls-Royce, International Aero Engines.

Leahy says the NEO’s catalogue price will have a premium of around $8 million over the existing models. “It may be even a bit higher, depending on which engine you choose, and then you’ll have to assume some discount off that.”

Today’s A320 models have catalogue prices between $74 million and $96 million, ranging from the smaller A319 variant to the larger A321 version. The manufacturer has so far indicated that the upgrade will not be offered on the smallest single-aisle variant, the A318.

Bonne soirée

Bonjour !

le NEO ne prospère pas ..! Sauf pour Cadre-Emplois !
A preuve ... ouarf !


Évidemment il y aura une période d'essai ... et tant que ce n'est pas signé, c'est encore dans le domaine de la prospective , bien sûr !

Bon j'ouvre un peu des fois que des ordres de discrétion ... fassent changer qq chose dans l'annonce (Date à jour au 25-11)

http://www.cadremploi.fr/emploi/detail_offre?offreId=11000925804

Entreprise

EADS est un leader mondial de l'aéronautique, de l'espace, de la défense et des services associés. En 2009, le Groupe - comprenant Airbus, Astrium, Cassidian et Eurocopter - a dégagé un chiffre d'affaires de 42,8 milliards d'euros et employé plus de 119 000 personnes.
Type de contrat : CDI
Poste

Intégration systèmes de propulsion nacelle/moteur (h/f)
Référence de l'offre: 10116085 EL FR CAD 1

Description du poste
Vous intégrerez l'équipe de projet chargée de l'intégration des systèmes de moteur/nacelle dans le cadre du nouveau programme A320 NEO. Vous serez notamment chargé(e) de la gestion du développement des composants de montage moteur EBU (Engine Build-Up).
Profil

Tâches & Activités
Vous aurez les missions principales suivantes :
- définir les exigences (et les moyens de conformité) nécessaires au fabricant de nacelles chargé de la conception, de la fabrication et de l'installation de ces composants pour garantir une intégration optimale,
- valider la conception et l'installation des composants,
- vérifier la conformité avec les spécifications et l'intégration finale,
- gérer la configuration des produits,
- préparer le dossier de certification.
Vous coordonnerez l'activité avec le fabricant de moteurs et/ou de nacelles et les domaines Airbus concernés.

Avis aux amateurs !

Et celui là à Filton !
Peut être déjà vu !

http://www.totaljobs.com/JobSeeking/Senior-Fatigue--Damage-Tolerance-Engineer_job49052616

Description of the job
A vacancy has arisen for a Senior Fatigue & Damage Tolerance (F&DT) engineer to be based at Airbus UK on the Filton site (Bristol)
As the successful applicant you will be working within the Wing and Pylon Centre of Excellence team in delivering the A320/A321 New Engine Option derivative aircraft. You will be responsible for all Fatigue and Damage Tolerance related activities, which will include wingbox strengthening modifications, through the Design, Data for Manufacture and Certification phases of the NEO project.

The role will require working across different structural teams and also to liaise and work with different functions. There will be further opportunities to develop and grow into wider structures roles within the Wing & Pylon Design organisation. You will report operationally to the Engineering Programme Manager and functionally to the Chief of Fatigue for Serial Aircraft Development

Tasks
As the successful candidate your principle activities will include:

•Ensuring appropriate quality and a consistent and unified approach across TWE for the technical solution definition and processes for Fatigue & Damage Tolerance of Wing and Pylon Structural Assessment for A320 NEO.
•Working transnationally with all Wing & Pylon teams on the A320 NEO programme addressing all F&DT aspects.
•Ensuring compliance with relevant policies within the TWE department.
•Liaising and working with Wing & Pylon Section Stress Specialists to ensure appropriate policy and technical solutions are being applied across all departments involved with F&DT.
•Liaising and working with suppliers to ensure appropriate policies and technical solutions are being applied for F&DT.
•Being responsible for all F&DT work carried out, including technical direction and guidance to all TWE F&DT engineers, off-load engineers and Risk Sharing Partners delivery engineers working on the programme.
•Being responsible for the capture, codification and dissemination of local TWE F&DT policy for A320 NEO activities.
•Discussing and agreeing any changes that affect outside parties.
•Reviewing the technical solution for all significantly new A320 NEO solutions to ensure they are appropriate to the F&DT solution
•Providing F&DT input into the development of training, mentoring, methods development requests, test requests, etc.
•Being responsible for the signatory development of F&DT engineers within TWE A320 NEO and its supply base, including making clear signatory evidence requirements, the creation of signatory development plans and the assessment of the suitability of engineers for F&DT signature delegation.
•Supporting all technical audits, internal and external, that affect F&DT for TWE, for example EASA audits.
•Periodically perform audits of the internal quality of F&DT work within TWE and its suppliers and report any shortcomings and recovery actions to the TWE Head of Design.
•Being responsible for highlighting any F&DT technical risks to the Operations Manager for incorporation into the TWE risk register and highlight high-risk items to the TWE Head of Design as soon as they are identified.
•Supporting the resource planning and management for TWE, especially for F&DT.
•Supporting Lean Engineering improvements at a high level for TWE, including sharing lessons learnt across all TWE Wing & Pylon Sections.
•Developing and maintaining the necessary relationships with Local Chief Engineers to support F&DT Engineering work.

Bon , rien n'est écrit , mais ....on embauche, du moins on consulte

JPRS

Well Done, Sherlock Holmes ! Rien ne vous échappe/FT

Troublant

On me dira, les recrutements, tant que rien n'est signer on peut les arrêter quand on veux.

Belle loupe en tout cas Beochien ! Bon flair !

Ben, je n'aime pas trop me faire entuber, par les PR et les Mktg ... ou autres vendeurs de la perfection, comme chez RR !
Donc je cherche un peu autour, et c'est parfois intéressant !

JPRS

Très intéressant article sur les remotorisation

http://www.speednews.com/CMS.aspx?pn=Dec2010&pid=3448&psec=GUEST

Il faut s'inscrire si le lien ne marche pas (inscription gratuite...)

A lire (ce que je suis en train de faire)

Bonne journée

Un petit extrait

For investors, we believe that fears about the potential impact of reengining
on fleet values are overblown. In our view, the main driver of
current low values for in-service aircraft is the level of narrowbody supply
against industry demand that is only now emerging from the bottom
of the latest recession. The anemic level of financing available even for
5-year-old aircraft only aggravates the problem. Our analysis suggests
that the large installed base of 737NGs and A320 aircraft families and the
absence of significant maintenance issues as they have aged (to date)
will ensure continued demand for the aircraft, even if Airbus and Boeing
shift production entirely to re-engined models.

Qu'en pense SUH ?

Ben je l'ai ouvert parfaitement (Sans m'inscrire) et c'est très intéressant !
Surtout la part historique ... les 9-10 % d'écos dans les cas cités, avec un prix du fuel beaucoup plus bas !
Donc, attention, tout est très lié au coût du kérosène et today ...

Bien que l'auteur s'abstienne de conclure !

J'ai lu la "NEO Saga" d'Oliver Wyman avec grand intérêt : merci bcp Poncho !!/FT

Bonsoir à tous,

Tout est dans le titre !
Cela laisse de la place pour le NEO.

Airbus: No plans to replace A320 family of jets before 2025

BRUSSELS (AP) - Airbus says it has no plans to replace its A320 family of medium-range passenger jets before 2025 despite competition from new manufacturers.

Airbus senior Vice President Rainer Ohler said Tuesday that a new project costing about euro10 billion ($13 billion) would not be justified unless it could offer a 25 percent increase in overall performance. He says new technologies needed to achieve this target are not available.

Airbus' rival Boeing Co. has been mulling the replacement of its 737 family — the best-selling airliner ever — while Airbus is developing the A350 long-range jet liner and A400M heavy military transport.

Airbus is still working on the newly introduced A380, the largest passenger jet in the world.

http://www.canadianbusiness.com/markets/market_news/article.jsp?content=D9JQINQ00

Amicalement